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Thelma Adams: Reading Between the Lines in The Reader: When is Abuse Not Abuse?



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- MotheringHeights See Profile I'm a Fan of MotheringHeights permalink

I haven't seen the movie but, as always, love hearing what you think about it. Am glad that you are questioning the erotic portrayal.

Sounds like a perfect brooding role for Ralph.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:43 AM on 12/04/2008
- drinne See Profile I'm a Fan of drinne permalink

I hate to point this out, but it's apparent that the movie does indeed show that the relationship while pretty and glamourous in the abstract is abusive and damaging in the long run. Your own review shows it as an apt metaphor for hidden damage passed from one generation to another.

If it were less subtle with the effects of the dominant relationship affecting the grown man, it would no longer be a metaphor for hidden damage, it would be a completely different film about how difficult it is to be sexually involved with older women when you are a teenager and why it's damaging, I'm assuming that's not the subject of the film.

As to the Miley Cirus comparsion - Miley is currently 16. David Kross is currently 18 playing a role as a 15 year old. It is not child pornography if everyone is an adult.

Miley is an american female being marketed to 12 year olds that was taking pictures, not a working actor in Europe in an Oscar weight movie. She would be being exploited and underage. David Cross is neither.

There are better arguments to hang "abuse" on then a film where it seems that "damaged and corrupt while still beautiful" is the theme, according to this article's read of the movie.

David Cross is not a child, this movie does not seem to be treating the relationship as 100% positive.I think you were on slightly stronger ground about the Lebovitz pics.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:43 PM on 12/03/2008
- Thelma Adams - Huffpost Blogger I'm a Fan of Thelma Adams permalink

You've raised a number of issues. Allow me to clarify on this one point. While the actor David Kross is 18, the character he plays is clearly underage. I'm addressing the depiction of characters -- one an adult female, the other an underage male -- within the story, not any abuse in the making of the movie. That's the crux. How would we feel about this, how do we feel about the scenario if the genders were reversed, how does our culture feel about it, how do women and men vary in their responses, how do those who have been abused respond? And, also, how does the law treat the behavior. Clearly, in that case, the laws within the film are those of post-War Germany, not contemporary America.

Also, you're definition of adult may be different from mine and the law's. Fifteen and sixteen are minors, and therefore under the age of consent, and incapable of a consensual relationship under the law.

I am open to different interpretations of the movie, and to wide-ranging reactions to the coupling of older women/younger men, but I find that the filmmakers definitely eroticize the abusive relationship in a way that is not morally ambigous, and I find disturbing.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 05:12 PM on 12/03/2008
- New jojojo See Profile I'm a Fan of jojojo permalink

You are exactly right in your article. The movie, like "Birth" with Nicole Kidman and the old French film "Murmur of the Heart," make female predation on a young male into an OK act. This is NOT OK. Rape is rape. Molestation is molestation. Pedo[hilia is pedophilia. The gender of the victim and victimizer does not matter one bit.

Can you imagine these directors and writers and producers reversing the genders? Of course not! They would never remotely consider it.

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 12:30 PM on 12/04/2008
- drinne See Profile I'm a Fan of drinne permalink

same thing for you and it detracts from the overall movie.

(sorry cut off the the tag end of the last post)

    Reply    Favorite    Flag as abusive Posted 08:06 PM on 12/03/2008