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Quit Blaming India, Support Its Transition To Cleaner Development: U.N. Deputy Climate Change Chief Interview

Quit Blaming India, Support Its Transition To Cleaner Development: U.N. Deputy Climate Change Chief Interview
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Pacific Press via Getty Images
UNITED NATIONS, NEW YORK, NY, UNITED STATES - 2015/09/17: Janos Pasztor answers a question at the press briefing. Janos Pasztor, the UN Assistant Secretary-General on Climate Change, and Amina Mohammed, the Secretary-General's Special Advisor on Post-2015 Development Planning, participated in a press conference covering an array of interrelated topics, ranging from the relationship of climate change to refugee situations globally to the upcoming Paris Conference on climate change. (Photo by Albin Lohr-Jones/Pacific Press/LightRocket via Getty Images)

PARIS -- Four days into the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Paris, India has come under pressure to rein in its CO2 emissions especially from coal, which, the country needs to meet its energy requirements for economic growth and providing electricity to 300 million people who still don't have access to power.

India has laid down an ambitious plan to generate 40 percent energy from non-fossil fuel source by 2040, and is willing to do more if it receives the required finance and technology from the international community. But it isn't ready to compromise on its development, which involves doubling its coal consumption over the next decade.

Responding to concerns that India's coal plans could derail the global response to the crisis, Prime Minister Narendra Modi has asked developed countries to free up the remaining carbon space for developing countries. "Progress is our destiny," he said, while speaking at COP21, earlier this week.

HuffPost India spoke with Janos Pasztor , U.N. Assistant Secretary General for Climate Change, about the focus on India during the initial days of the conference.

Pasztor, a soft-spoken Hungarian diplomat, who has been involved in the climate change negotiations for almost two decades, advised against turning the conference into a blame game and suggested other ways of getting things done.

India is being isolated from the start of the conference. Do you think is fair?

That is what it is happening. I don't think that is a good thing. I think there are other ways to address these issues. It is very clear to me that India has to be able to provide more to its citizens in the future. There are lot of poor people in India and they need to be brought out of poverty. And for that you need economic growth. And you need energy. The question is how can the international community help to make sure that transition which India has to go through, which will include fossil fuels, there is no doubt about it, how can that transition be made in such a way that will help the minimal impact on emissions.

There are certain countries which are pushing India, well India has to do more...more what? Maybe, we can look at it the other way, and say what investments can we generate in India to make sure that fossil fuels, that coal is burnt as efficiently as possible, how can we get the latest technologies to India. And also to support the plans of Prime Minister Modi. He has got incredible plans for renewable energy expansion. These are fantastic things, but it will need investment, and I think that this where we should be putting our efforts into.

It is very clear to me that India has to be able to provide more to its citizens in the future. There are lot of poor people in India and they need to be brought out of poverty.

Do you think these certain countries should stop attacking India?

It is not my business to tell countries what to do. I'm just saying that in my view, it is a much better approach to look at this as an opportunity for development, for technology development, a different kind of technology development that is either emissions free or lower emissions than the existing systems. Lets not make this into a blame game. When you start comparing countries...who is right...who is wrong...who should do more...who should do less, it gets very complicated. I don't think it is very helpful.

In essence that is why we have today is this nationally determined contributions (Intended Nationally Determined Contributions). Really, the idea is that let every country say that this is what we can do unconditionally and if we can get more resources from the international community then we can do even more. I think that is a very good way to proceed.

The word - obstructionist - has been used to describe India - do you think that's true?

No, I don't think so. But I think like every country, India is here to look at and look after their national interest. Now where every country has a challenge, not just India, is to take your national interest and combine it with the global interest. And there has to be a balance. And it's not easy to find that balance.

Now where every country has a challenge, not just India, is to take your national interest and combine it with the global interest.

In his speech here, PM Modi talked about the need for developed countries to free up carbon space and give developing countries a chance. Do you agree?

There is no question about it. The IPCC was very clear that there is only a limited amount of space left to emit more carbon. So we know the total, and we also know that historically what has been put in there. So those facts are there. There is not much you can do about it. That is why the Convention is very clear. The developed countries have to take a lead. And it is for that reason. Now, that is what this whole negotiation is all about. What that means in practice - common but differentiated responsibilities according to the capacities and capabilities of countries so that is why it is so difficult to go through this because it is not easy to come to a conclusion that works. But I'm reasonably confident when I hear the discussions, when I hear the ministers of governments, there will be a solution.

Developed countries have to take a lead.

Do the INDCs show that developed countries have taken a lead?

Every countries need to do more. There is no question about it. We're not there. We're maybe around 3 degrees (Celsius) if we implement everything - if we implement everything. So every country clearly we need to more. The developed countries have made efforts, some countries have made very substantial efforts, others need to do more. But this is part of the process that we have here, countries will provide their national plans, and then countries will be discussing and not pressuring in any form or way that this country needs to do 10 percent more or five percent less. But it will be on the table and let countries discuss what else needs to be done to stay below the 2 degree (Celsius) mark.

Every countries need to do more. There is no question about it. We're not there.

Do you think the principles of - common but differentiated responsibilities and equity - been dilute or are these still strong considerations?

I think it is still a very strong consideration. I think it will stay. The question is what that means at a practical level. And it has implications on reporting process, implications on financing, implications on a whole series of things within the agreement. I think, the principle will be there, and even if we do end up with one system, that is way it is being discussed with many countries, but still lets have that flexibility so different countries will have different levels of capacity and development will be able to still deliver. Some of the reporting requirements require considerable capacities for data collection, processing, things like that, which some developing countries simply don't have. Developed countries took many years to have their reporting requirements sorted out.

Do you think "differentiation" should be based on Annex 1 and non-Annex 1 countries (developed and developing) from the 1997 Kyoto Protocol, or it needs to change?

It depends on who you are talking to.

In your opinion?

There is no doubt that things have evolved. Things have evolved in every sense. As I said at the very beginning of our discussion that there are countries that have a lot of poverty and just because there maybe some big cities with financial centres doesn't mean that the totality of the population is living at the level that one would hope for everyone in this world.

How are the negotiations going, so far?

It is early times, but generally speaking it is going well. The Heads of States presence here the first day had a very strong political impulse that we need to get an agreement by the end of next week. So lets see.

COP21 coverage on HuffPost India is supported by CANSA and PAIRVI.

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15 Breathtaking Trekking Trails Across India
Kumara Parvatha Trek, Karnataka(01 of15)
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The second highest peak (at 1712 metres) in Kodagu, Kumara Parvatha is a popular peak to climb. However, the 15-kilometre trek is no cake walk, although it does offer some scenic views. The starting point is on temple road, approximately a quarter of a kilometre from the Kukke Subramanya temple. While water and food is available at Battara Mane (the second pitstop), there are no washrooms. October to February is the best time to trek. (credit:Karthick Siva/Flickr)
Roopkund Trek, Uttarakhand(02 of15)
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For those who enjoy more daring experiences, this trek presents an opportunity to view Roopkund's famous Mystery Lake. The glacial lake is also known as Skeleton lake on account of the skeletons that reside at the bottom of the lake. Trekking can take anywhere from a week to 9 days, and the best time to visit is between May and October. This challenging trek requires one to be in decent shape, given that is situated at a high altitude (4,800 mts). There are three trekking routes: via Mundoli, Kathgodam or Lohjang. (credit:trodly/Flickr)
Chembra Peak Trek, Kerala(03 of15)
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Located 2,100 metres above sea level, Chembra in Wayanad is the tallest peak in Kerala. It's an easy climb, though the initial gradient can prove a little steep. Best to visit during September - February, the trek extends across 9 kilometres, and can easily be completed within a day. However, visitors can opt to extend their trip by a couple of days: the combination of exploring Wayanad's grassy meadows and then residing by the heart-shaped lake (Hridaya Saras) at the top is an experience to be savoured. (credit:www.beontheroad.com/Flickr)
Araku Valley Trek, Andhra Pradesh(04 of15)
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If you're a rookie trekker with a hankering for excellent coffee, Araku Valley situated in scenic Vizag is a must-visit. It is something of a tourist spot - the Borra caves, tribal museum and Katiki waterfalls have made it pretty popular. Serious trekkers can afford to give it a miss. (credit:flickrPrince/Flickr)
Valley of Flowers Trek, Uttarakhand(05 of15)
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Possibly one of the most beautiful treks in India, the name 'Valley of Flowers' holds true: this exotic valley is transformed into a colourful kaleidoscope stuffed with wild flowers such as zinnias, petunias and poppies. It also hosts several species of butterflies and endangered animals such as the mountain leopard and blue sheep. A moderately challenging climb (the entire trek can take a week), the 10-kilometre valley is situated at approximately over 3,600 metres (above sea level), and is ideal to visit from between June - September. (credit:Flickmor/Flickr)
Dzongri Trek, West Sikkim(06 of15)
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If you have eight days or a fortnight to spare, a trek to Dzongri will grant you some spectacular views of Mount Kanchenjunga (the third highest peak in the world). A tough climb by any standards, the trek commences from Yuksom (a popular base for Mt. Everest trekkers), and is best undertaken between September to November or March and April. Dzongri sits at 4,000 metres. (credit:Alankar/Flickr)
Rajmachi Trek, Maharashtra(07 of15)
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The Rajmachi fort, thanks to the efforts of the Maharashtra Tourism Board, is developing quickly as a tourist spot. The beauty of this trekking destination is not just its panoramic view of lush rolling hills. It also presents two trekking options, both of which can be completed within one day. There is a plain 15-kilometre walk from Lonavala or a rugged 2,000-foot climb from Kondivade village where one can also view the Kondana caves. The best time to visit is between June and September. (credit:Ravindra R/Flickr)
Markha Valley Trek, Ladakh(08 of15)
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The beauty of this trek is the sheer amount of Ladhaki/ Tibetan culture one comes across on the way. The local tribes with their yaks make for picturesque settings against the multi-coloured Tibetan flags, clear blue skies and barren ground, as you trek along the Markha River through Little Tibet. Set at an altitude of 5,200 metres, the 80-kilometre trek is best undertaken in August or September, and can extend from 10 days to two weeks. (credit:MANPREET ROMANA via Getty Images)
Chadar Trek, Ladakh(09 of15)
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If you've had enough of trekking over rolling glades or mountainous peaks, try walking over a frozen river next January. The frozen river Zanskar (also called Chadar that literally means sheet) situated in the Zanskar Valley presents an intriguing yet challenging trek, extending across 105 kilometres at extremely low temperatures (-25 degrees at night). The swiftly flowing river freezes over only in the months of January to February, and can prove an arduous obstacle to cross: one has to climb over icy rocks, and sleep in caves at night. The view combined with ice sheets that constantly change colour however, makes it an unparalleled experience. (credit:www.beontheroad.com/Flickr)
Lamayuru Trek, Ladakh(10 of15)
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Playing host to one of the oldest monastries in Ladakh, Gompa (built in the 11th century), Lamayuru at over 5,000 metres holds a certain mystic allure. It has become one of the more popular treks in Ladakh commencing from Zanskar. Situated between Kargil and Leh, it is one of the tougher treks and requires at three weeks to undertake.Trekking season commences from June till mid-October. (credit:Alberto Bertotto/Flickr)
Goecha La Trek, West Sikkim(11 of15)
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Covering 90 kilometres over 11 days doesn't sound like the toughest deal, but don't underestimate this trek, beautiful as it is. Best to visit between April and September, the trek passes through Kanchenjunga National Park (a photographer's delight). Samiti Lake is another visual delight that props up on the trek. (credit:Le photo à Go-Go/Flickr)
Indrahar Pass Trek, Himachal Pradesh(12 of15)
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A mountain pass in the Dhauladhar range, this is located close to Dharamsala at approximately 4,300 metres, and attracts a large trekking crowd between April and October. The trek starts from Bhagsu or Dharamkot, near Mcleod Ganj, and can take from 4-10 days to complete. (credit:rouadec/Flickr)
Deoriatal Trek, Uttarkhand(13 of15)
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Deoriatal combined with visiting Tungnath and Chandrashila makes for an ideal weekend trek. Situated at a distance of approximately 3 kilometres from Sari village, Deoriatal's clear waters provide a beautiful reflection of the Chaumkhamba and Kedar peaks at sunset. (credit:travelling slacker/Flickr)
Kodachadri Trek, Karnataka(14 of15)
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Between October and January, trekking enthusiasts can head to Kodachadri that rests at an altitude of 1343m, opting from three different routes. The Hindlumane Falls make for a refreshing pitstop during the two-day trek that only involves a six-hour journey. (credit:Premnath Thirumalaisamy/Flickr)
Chandratal Lake Trek, Himachal Pradesh(15 of15)
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Its romantic name (literally translated, Lake of the Moon) matched with its easy journey setting makes for an amorous vacation. Situated in Spiti valley, at a height of approximately 4,300 metres, this one-kilometre long lake is a popular destination for campers, and should be visited between May to October. Trekking enthusiasts headed to the Hampta Pass can also plan their route to spend a day here. (credit:mishox/Flickr)
-- This article exists as part of the online archive for HuffPost India, which closed in 2020. Some features are no longer enabled. If you have questions or concerns about this article, please contact indiasupport@huffpost.com.